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Author Topic: My laser engraver from 0 knowledge to 32.461% .... probably  (Read 14887 times)
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ArtF
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« Reply #45 on: January 24, 2020, 08:09:49 AM »

Bobby:

  To truly amaze yourself, google for "3d grayscale". The results from those are most impressiv e
and Auggie will make a multipass 3d object from them. Its interesti ng to see the depth linearity
when doing such an object.
  Looks like you well on your way. Congratul ations.

Art
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BobbyW
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« Reply #46 on: January 26, 2020, 02:55:22 PM »


  Looks like you well on your way. Congratul ations.

Art

Hi.
Not that fast Art , not that fast > Is true , on engraving i try almost everythin g , and day by day , gett'in better .
 I try on glass, back of the mirror , working realy nice , almost all materials i've get.
The problem now is of cutting that's materials .
I try some shapes , and on circles was realy strange .
I try to made the DXP file in Corel Draw , no way to can group all objects > No skills in that type of programs.
After i try in inkscape , create DXF and import in vexx to convert to GCODE> then , on lines work but on circles , no way ,
the laser don't even shoot , only on the big circle i draw,  but interrupt ed line .
I put the file below , what program i should use and what is the best option ?
Thanks

* button ok 2.zip (2.22 KB - downloaded 40 times.)
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ArtF
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« Reply #47 on: January 26, 2020, 03:14:41 PM »

Hi Bobby:

  Try this..

1) I Imported the DXF into Vexx using DXF Import.
2) Select all objects by drawing a selection box around them, then selected Edit/Group
3) Press FastGCode Button. Unlselect the feedrate and Z options for laser.
4) File generated as attached.

   When you run such a file, you have to manually do the M3 to enable the laser before
running the file. The circles imported from the DXF as line segments, not circles,
though you coudl use Vexx to convert them to circles by selecting them individua lly and
using the convert to arcs button. Then group for Gcode output..

  I ran the test file and it runs OK here, make sure you enter a feedarate high enough..

Couple notes.

   All th epevisou work you ide was photo work, Jerk settings may not affect such
work badly. The real test of Jerk Settings is in this type of file. The speed the circles
will achieve is a mixture of requested feedrate, and Jerk from the radius of the
circles. If you find they wont run fast as you wish, raise your JerkLimit substanti ally
and find the sweet spot where it runs fast enough , but not too fast.

Art

* buttonok.tap (14.96 KB - downloaded 47 times.)
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BobbyW
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« Reply #48 on: January 27, 2020, 03:46:30 AM »

Hi Art
   When you run such a file, you have to manually do the M3 to enable the laser before
running the file.
Yes , i figure out that .
Quote
The circles imported from the DXF as line segments, not circles
Yes , that i notice , on big circle i saw the interrupt ed power , so i figure out are not a continuou s arc , just small segments.
And on the small circles laser dont even shoot. I will made more test's.

Quote
The speed the circles
will achieve is a mixture of requested feedrate, and Jerk from the radius of the
circles.
My feedrate was on maxim is writed in config. 12000 , run ok now when laser move without burn . But when i decrease the percent , i saw the power will drop considera bly
//~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I have a question . I open the Gearotic software for curiosity , and i saw there on image processin g , is the same AUGS used in Auggie to generate the code but not on same size and less options.
It is possible to have the option to can made that to run also on full screen ? That should very useful , on small screen you can not realy see what truly happen with photo.
Thanks
Bobby
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BobbyW
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« Reply #49 on: January 30, 2020, 05:00:13 PM »

Hi
This night made me crazy , I can not rid off on that stupid ellipse. Engraving working fine , i can do almost everythin g
i want .
The problem is on cutting. and is not about the power, i have a lot for what i try , is about my settings that for sure
First , i try all the speed and mixed , also i figure out what "jerk" do, i hope  Embarrassed
(i didn't figure out what mean , look ahead , and radius settings)
So, If i made one shape , as square and i set some power speed , feed for that , working perfect . How i wish .
If i made a circle, also working. The problem is on different size of circles. On small ones , he don't even burn
also on that circle he like just stop for some ms and made a short gap without burn.
I made a bunch of test's on paper , just above to pass trough , and i figure out , soon the curve going small power decrease radical.
Can be the problem because the motors don't have any reduction rate, Are directly connected on X and Y .
That can be a problem ? They have a lot of power , that why i didn't mount any reduction well.
I can run so fast to almost break my axes , and don't even get on half on load current on motors .
I'm totaly lost now. I give up and go on sleep to clean my head
I put some photo below.
https://youtu.be/csM47s0ysK4
Thanks


* small elipse.jpg (106.96 KB, 1600x900 - viewed 95 times.)

* engrave plexic test.jpg (87.77 KB, 900x1600 - viewed 87 times.)
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tweakie
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« Reply #50 on: January 31, 2020, 01:23:15 AM »

Hi Bobby,

Looking at your video it appears that you have a problem with your laser triggerin g circuit. It seems to be triggerin g late rather than at the exact moment of axis movement and it also appears to drop-out during axis movement.

Tweakie.
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BobbyW
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« Reply #51 on: January 31, 2020, 01:53:18 AM »

Hi Bobby,

Looking at your video it appears that you have a problem with your laser triggerin g circuit. It seems to be triggerin g late rather than at the exact moment of axis movement and it also appears to drop-out during axis movement.

Tweakie.

Yes i thinking on that too ' but on engrave no any problem at all. Also the problem seem's to be on motors tuning.
Because if i try on double size circle or ellipse, no any problem at all.
That is only at small pieces i try to cut , below 2 cm .
Trigger circuit i made is no way to have any uS delay ( and on that speed even mS don't affect the trigger ), i don't even use an integrato r for that ,
the internal capacitan ce of source and wires are enough to have fine analog input. I use a good OP and a MOS optocuple r.
Right now i don't even know where to start to debug , obviously no any experienc e with that  in the past.
I will made more test from 0 . Also ,  maybe trying to change the driver parameter's of the motors ?  Grin
Thanks
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tweakie
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« Reply #52 on: January 31, 2020, 02:05:33 AM »

If you .zip and post a copy of the Gcode which exhibits the problem (shown in your video) then I will run it here and at least rule out one possible cause.

Tweakie.
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BobbyW
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« Reply #53 on: January 31, 2020, 02:15:07 AM »

If you .zip and post a copy of the Gcode which exhibits the problem (shown in your video) then I will run it here and at least rule out one possible cause.

Tweakie.
I try to edit my post , you already answer . Cheesy
 EDIT later :
If i try to set the power very accurate , now i can do it on one single shape and no smaller than 2 cm . I can set to cut a paper without even to pass below ( cut just the paper and he didn't smoke , just cut)
If you notice in video , is a ellipse , but is 3 cm piece . If i draw the second one half of the size and i try to cut , the result will be like in my first video you watch.
I made a small vid to see what happen . To say simply , more smaller than 2 cm the piece will be , more inconsist ent the power will be and also , if i mixt different shapes on different sizes
the power will be a mess .
https://youtu.be/U8SnTyCUAt0

And the code  is simply made by " vexx " . Nothing special , you can download what Art post some post below ( i'm at work , not home now  Roll Eyes )
Also if i try to download and run the code he attach , tle laser will burn hard the big circle and on small ones , dont even shoot.
I think my problem is acc and velocity setting .

Thanks again
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ArtF
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« Reply #54 on: January 31, 2020, 08:05:01 AM »

Hi Bobby:

  I can see a problem or two in your tests..

All your boxes show on takeoff the laser isn't shooting at the start..

This may explain small circles as they never get up to speed. So a couple things to discuss.. .

First, as the laser takes off on a move, the formula for power internall y is

  max( minpwmset ting , (ActualSpe ed / Feedrate) * power )

  So in the config, the minPWM sets the startup cutting power as the axis
starts to move if the axis is so slow the power computed is less than minPWM.
 SO to set this approxima tely correct, make a square
in gcode. Cut it as you have and if there is no burn at the start of each
corner increase the setting Planner/MinPWM until you see each corner
has been cut. Set you feedrate so your table actually hits it in the velocity DRO,
(or close anyway, it doesnt have to be perfect.. but if you see 1589 is the fastest
it goes, set the feedrate to 1600 or so. )

   The second problem is that feedrate and jerk are related. Jerk is defined
as the amount of mechanica l jerk the machine can do, or how much jerk
occurs during a move.  As its lowered, the axis will move slower. As its raised,
the axis will move faster.If this is too low, you will not be able to move
fast enough on small segment programs. Another considera tion is
look ahead. If a circle is made of hundreds of Gcode lines, the program
can only see ahead by the setting of Lookahead . Change this to
300 or so and it can see and thus plan for higher speeds.

 If you run a program without laser on, see what max feedrate is achived in
that small circle , the math is that a small circle may never hit the feedrate
you desire, so power will never hit it as well. For example, if your feedrate
is set to 5000, and you have 2 circles, one large and one very small.

  The feedrate in the large may hit 4000 ( for example) but the small
circle may only hie 1000. If so , the power of the small circle will be 1/4th
the power of the large. In this case the feedrate for the program should
be set to 1000. (Or a feedrate for the small circle of 1000 and for the large
4000.)

  Jerk in a circle is computed as a function of its radius. The larger the
radius and mathemati cally the smaller the resultant jerk. Smaller circles
have larger jerk.


  So I would first look to the square and adjust the minPWM to make it
start that corner with power high enough to burn. If you turn off
DistCorre ction ( button on the laser control), you will then get
the set laser power at all times during motion, which can be fine in cutting
but will cut harder when its slow due to planning motion.

  It takes some playing to get this right. Unlike normal CNC where motion
alone is enough to cut, Auggie needs to get the power to be properly proportio nal
to speed, which is why all the power settings.

Let me know how the squares corners come out with adjustmen ts and we'll go
from there. Smiley

Thx
Art

 

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BobbyW
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« Reply #55 on: January 31, 2020, 08:23:38 AM »

If you .zip and post a copy of the Gcode which exhibits the problem (shown in your video) then I will run it here and at least rule out one possible cause.

Tweakie.
I got home and i start to play again> So i start to read again what Art say me , the entire tunning process .
I change my config from 3200 to 12800 steps , (i put the file below) and do it step by step and..... the result was the same
but at least , i got some knowledge ++  Undecided
Anyway , i put below that code how you ask me , but i don't think that matter , the result are the same ,
i try a lot of programs to generate , same result , so..... i think i will keep digging  Sad
Big square test as Art suggested
https://youtu.be/tSRGY6CA1iI
and movig test for tunning max speed and accelerat ion
https://youtu.be/2qOZfn9ruWk

Thanks

* calibrare laser.zip (7.33 KB - downloaded 47 times.)
* calibrare.txt (0.92 KB - downloaded 41 times.)
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BobbyW
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« Reply #56 on: January 31, 2020, 09:11:54 AM »

Hi Bobby:

 SO to set this approxima tely correct, make a square
in gcode. Cut it as you have and if there is no burn at the start of each
corner increase the setting Planner/MinPWM until you see each corner
has been cut. Set you feedrate so your table actually hits it in the velocity DRO,
(or close anyway, it doesnt have to be perfect.. but if you see 1589 is the fastest
it goes, set the feedrate to 1600 or so. )

Thx
Art

Yes , i attach some files in my previous post , we write in same time  Cheesy (can see my test notes in that .txt)
So , i made the test how you say .
On beginning was the same , after i rise "jerk" to 6000000 (i was annoyed in that moment) and surprisel y , he cut nice the square .
?? How much i can rise the jerk ? Exist a limit value for ?
Also i put min PWM at 20% , i have second power control at analog on min/max power and i set the power just to barely cut the paper.
I notice , the tool hit almost all time the feed set , excluding that small ellipse when decrease the power.
I put on max CV radius 0.10 (what is hes effect ?) i didn't notice any diff.
https://youtu.be/LU0qrUX1Pxw

//~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
AND not at least , today i find out you are the creator of Mach 3 , man , a awesome work realy , i never used but , every time i look at one video about
machining , that Mach 3 remain in my mind. Again my intuition didn't fail . I have such a big respect for you .

Thanks for everythin g you do for as
Bobby

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ArtF
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« Reply #57 on: January 31, 2020, 12:20:17 PM »

Hi Bobby:

  Jerk can be a large number. I sometimes use 1000000 and sometimes 50,000,000,
depends on what Im doing and how it reacts. Setting Jerk very high basically reduces
smoothing, but some systems dont need smoothing so a high jerk is fine. The limit is
in the billions I think..

  That last video looked much better. If your doing an ellipse there are many small moves in
some code, so make sure your look ahead is high.. maybe 400 - 500. This helps the planner get
up to speed. Small circles calculate jerk a bit different ly as they have to take radial vector
pressures into account. Its all a balance, but I think your getting there, the last video showed
your very close to what you need. Play around with jerk and feedrates and eventuall y it will
sink in how they affect each other.

Thx
Art
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tweakie
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« Reply #58 on: February 01, 2020, 01:10:16 AM »

Hi Bobby,

Your last video shows great improveme nt so you are definitel y heading in the right direction .

Tweakie.
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BobbyW
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« Reply #59 on: February 02, 2020, 09:39:57 AM »

Hi ..
Thanks everyone for help. I figure out what " jerk " and other variable do . I manage to have constant power on
cutting almost on any shape i made . Now trying to script a "air button " for air assist , i found that library was already created
by @Ya-Nvr-No , and of course did't work , so . I start to look on you videos on youtube , and trying to see where are located all
variable in the system , i found some variable (including " AirAssist " ) variable , is duplicate in the my system.
That affect some how the Auggie funtional ity or is just a visual bug ?
I put below a screensho t of that
Thanks
Bobby


* laser max power.jpg (278.61 KB, 1595x867 - viewed 78 times.)
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