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Author Topic: Kinetic sculpture designed by Clayton Boyer  (Read 8943 times)
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ArtF
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« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2016, 12:11:14 PM »

Hi Guys:

  Heres a photo of the engine Im working on.. the top rotating stage isnt on it yet..

shows the spring arrangeme nt though..

Art


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ArtF
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« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2016, 12:14:48 PM »

Couple more showing how the spring is used..

  This is a spring from vuclan springs, the constant torque, should give a few hours of motion..



Art


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Kineticrazy
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« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2016, 12:57:18 PM »

The Bat Returns!!

Looks well built Art, beefy !! I'm curious about your mechanism, I'm imagining pawls on the outer wheel, that will trip that pawl off it's pin on the backstrok e? Does it advance one pin at the time? What size spring you got there? You've got me intrigued to say the least. Looking forward to pics of the outer wheel.

Good stuff,

Eric
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ArtF
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« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2016, 01:54:24 PM »

Eric:

  I got the springs awhile back, as I RECALL they are 4lb CT, about 160" long or something .. takes
20 winds on a 3" take-up spool. The outer pallet, as it spin's backwards grabs the pin the main ratchet is on, a magnet on the outer pawl then pulls the ratchet away leaving the outer pallet holding the pin on its own,This makes the outer pallet turn in reverse, and as it pulls away, the magnets separate and the main latch trips back in, thus one pin has turned. This means about 45 degrees of push per trip. This uses 2 magnets in a dual action, the first pulls the outer pawl in until it hits the pin, the magnet on the lower lever now is just offset enough to pull it outwards when friction releases it. This makes it dual action, the outer level pulls inwards to a limit, then the inner pulls outwards to the magnet, then it all reverses. 

   In testing, it seems ok but hasn't yet been fully assembled, I may end up switching the way it works as yet,
but I'm happy with the bottom, seems strong and has multiple possibili ties for tripping. . just gotta find one..

Smiley

Art
 

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Kineticrazy
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« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2016, 10:11:52 AM »

Art,
  I have nearly the same design. I'm wondering why you need the torsion spring to snap that pawl back in? wont gravity do the job?

I just attempted to post pics of my mechanism ....Forgi ve me,I can't figure out how...I click insert image and then don't know how to place the pics file from there.... any suggestio ns? (I did try the help function. ..all Greek to me) Sorry, I know I'm computer illiterat e Embarrassed
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ArtF
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« Reply #20 on: December 06, 2016, 10:22:08 AM »

Hi:

  To place images, there is a "additiona l options " button below your message. Click it and a browse button will appear so
you can attach an image ( or 4)..

  I used a spring, because the ring of brass pins are always under tension from the CT spring, and the trigger can happen at any angle
so long as the two platforms are spinning in reverse direction with the bottom turning cw. Alway hard to explain these things Smiley,,
which is why I hope to be able to allow simulatio ns of mechanism s like this one. Kinetic triggerin g can be so nonintuit ive that
Id like ot have a tool where I can play with shapes and how they interact as they spin .. might help creativit y some.

Art
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Kineticrazy
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« Reply #21 on: December 06, 2016, 12:37:20 PM »

OK Art, gotcha. I get the jist of your engine. They are hard to describe, but here goes....

Here are pics of my unfinishe d project. The upper (inner) pawl is lifted by magnets glued to small dowels inserted in the outer wheel. They are adjustabl e, hence the extra holes. In the pic in the following post you can see the outer pawl catching the ratchet as the magnets lift the inner pawl. Gravity drops both pawls. The magnets are placed opposite the heavier end of the arm, to get the most from the back swing.



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« Last Edit: December 06, 2016, 02:02:32 PM by Kineticrazy » Logged
Kineticrazy
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« Reply #22 on: December 06, 2016, 12:38:32 PM »

A couple more.....

Sorry for the huge pics, again, I don't know what I'm doing.... .. Undecided


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« Last Edit: December 06, 2016, 02:00:11 PM by Kineticrazy » Logged
ArtF
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« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2016, 02:11:53 PM »

Huge pics are fine, I liek them that way, allows me to zoom in on detail.

 You work as I do, experimen tation, changes, more experimen tation till it works. I
respect the process. I too tend to work that way, though the new bat was drawn and
conceived on paper, its the first one that was. Scimitar was seat of pants with many variation s
whicgh is why the drawings and such are piced together. Im hoping the bat is better
able to be documente d.

  Good work, keep it up..

Art
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Kineticrazy
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« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2016, 02:16:50 PM »

Art, I was thinking that David Roy's pawl is shaped to avoid slipping off it's pin. If you wanted to eliminate that spring you could sand the end of your pawl....

these pics show the wheel coming to rest, reversing position, and starting again.



* IMG_3585.JPG (802.55 KB, 3456x2592 - viewed 140 times.)
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Kineticrazy
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« Reply #25 on: December 06, 2016, 02:19:38 PM »

Sorry posting when you replied.. ..Thanks for your comments. Your seat of the pants design of scimitar is the reason I'm here!
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ArtF
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« Reply #26 on: December 06, 2016, 04:01:21 PM »

Im not so sure that would work for this design..b ecause of the way I designed the action of the trigger
it needs that spring to pull it back in just to eliminate the possabili ty fo runaway ratchet.. but we'll see, that design
may see many changes as I piece things together. .

Ill post videos as it starts to run.. if it starts to run.. Smiley

Art
 
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Kineticrazy
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« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2016, 04:46:34 PM »

Ah, I see. I imagine the 4 lb. spring would make things get moving pretty quick. I accidenta lly bought a 4.5 lb. constant force (not torque) spring the other day. I have been wondering if it would work. I'm glad to hear yours does. I'll have to draw mine out it's 40" length to use it though. I've been trying to think of ways to incorpora te it into a design. I imagine something like hiding the coiled end on a spool behind a faux flower pot (flat against the wall) and building a hollow flower stem to hide the rest of the spring,then a flower designed wheel like "Zinnia"on top. I'd wind a string on the Zinnia spool and attach it to the free end of the spring.

Or maybe the tail of some creature.

It's amazing once these machines get in your head, how much time you spend thinking about them ! Cheesy
« Last Edit: December 06, 2016, 05:04:14 PM by Kineticrazy » Logged
ArtF
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« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2016, 08:43:03 PM »

The original bat used a constant force spring, I thought it was constant torque, so I
spooled it that way. Worked fine.. but the guys at Vulcan spring told me it was wrong and
may wear out premature ly

Art
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Kineticrazy
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« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2016, 09:41:34 PM »

That's interesti ng. The spring I bought is rated at 25,000 uses as compared to constant torque springs rated at 2500. I wonder how much it will be affected? Did you back wind your spring, or wind in the springs natural direction? Had you noticed a differenc e in lifespan on your creation?

I would love to be able to wind it, it being compact really leaves a lot of options.

I hope you don't mind the questions Art, I appreciat e your time.

Eric

This spring is a bit of a monster Shocked



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